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Forums - When and how should I start immersing myself in the language?

Top > 日本語を勉強しましょう / Let's study Japanese! > Anything About Japanese



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I hear everyone praise language immersion, but I never heard how it works. I’ve been listening to Japanese vocoloid/ UTAU(?) for about 3+ years, not much songs in other languages. It’s not much but I feel like it’s both taught and not taught me pronunciation, and probably makes my pronunciation sound more “anime-ish.”

I also know I won’t be able to understand any of what they say in most immersion things, I know maximum 30 words. So is it worth it???

But, if anyone has experience in “ language immersion” then I’d love to hear what I should do~ any channel recommendations?

3
10 months ago
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マイコー
Level: 301

I would definitely hold off a bit until you have more vocabulary and grammar down. This is one of those questions where you can ask 10 people and get 11 answers, but I often would tell my students (when I was an in-classroom teacher) that you should aim for materials where you know roughly 80% of the content. This is for a couple of reasons:

1. Immersion does by native speakers at a young age is NOT what we as older language learners are doing. Just hearing/reading things in a passive setting (consuming media) is night-and-day different from the overwhelming amount of interactive language that babies and children are exposed to.

So listening/reading material without consideration for the level of the Japanese is going to often result in very low efficiency in learning. Think about how we learn new words in our own languages: we know most of what is being said, and when new words come up, we can use context/etc. to get a pretty good feel for what that word means. Hear it over and over again in multiple situations, and the words become part of our vocabulary.

So you need enough to be able to get the majority of the materials, otherwise there is not enough context clues to help you understand what you don't yet know.

2. Immersive studies is a lot of work, and it is VERY easy to get discouraged and give up. If you grab a manga that is above your level, start to read, then spend 5-10 minutes per page looking things up, it is going to feel like WORK very quickly, and the joy that you would have gotten from enjoying the manga will disappear.


So, I say 80%: if you understand or know roughly 80% of the content, then it's relatively reasonable for you to take a stab at. You have to make sure you're enjoying it, though!

And lastly, with regards to music - many of us are huge fans of Japanese music, and that's GREAT. It can feel great to listen to it and understand even small parts of the songs. As far as natural language goes, though, you cannot get much further away from it than songs (in any language). Songs are FULL of sentence fragments, use more poetic language than normal, is not representative of a normal conversation (so you cannot pick up on politeness levels, etc.), and involves a lot of indirect language, metaphor, etc.

So music can definitely be part of your immersion experience, but making it the main element will not be ideal for *most* people.

13
10 months ago
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The thing about immersion is, if you hear nothing but Japanese 24x7 for weeks and months at a time, you start to develop a feel for the sound of the language that you will never get from books or recordings. If you don’t go nuts first.

7
10 months ago
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Thanks for both responses, they helped a lot , I’ll make sure to not be listening to ONLY Japanese, when I don’t understand it, 24/7!

Though, I do love searching up a bunch of Japanese words online and writing the kanji down, so spending 5 minutes to understand a couple words, even though it’s inefficient, is fun for me

6
10 months ago
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Shamugan
Level: 561

In addition, you can also do a few more things to reach that goal more quickly.
First, activate the pronunciation setting for the vocabulary and sentence. It's in the quiz setting.
I don't know why マイコー is not talking about that wonderful setting that he created each time there is a question about immersion but it's like free passive training along your word and sentence studying. And it's a bit like the natural immersion that babies and children are exposed to (think of a mother pointing a word in a book while pronouncing that word). And you don't even need to study it actively. Just get that passive association and let your brain do the work. Later, it will help a lot. That setting is like one of the best setting on renshuu o/

At the same time, you can study the basic of pitch accent. And when I say basic, it's really that pitch accent is about pitch and maybe the different type of pitch accent. Just be conscious of them. You will not be able to distinguish them but just by noticing that word has that pitch accent from time to time, even if you don't feel or understand the difference, your brain will make that kind of association too. And in times, you will have enough example stored in your brain. And at that point, you will be able to notice the difference.

Second, choose more specific subject to study alongside your main study. By main study, I mean common word, grammar, kanji that you should learn. And besides that, create a schedule related to your interests. For example, if you like manga, you could study the onomatopoeia used in manga. Or if you like fantasy (manga, game, books), well create a schedule for that. Or even science, history, etc if you like those. Doesn't matter. It's important because it will significantly shorten from your first real immersion. Why? Well simply because those more specific subject will have different common word than the general common list. And it can be really frustrating to not be able to immerse yourself in your favorite medium after two years in just because you only studied general common words and a good part doesn't appear at all your favorite medium/genre/etc. Also, just because it's about your interest, your will have an easier time remembering them. Honestly, it's a bit difficult to manage and balance. And even right now, I often just do one or the other depending on the period because doing both at the same time is just too much work. So yeah, if you're more or less disciplined and managed to not be too greedy, you will probably have an easier time. And if you're not, well don't worry, I'm the same and I still manage to do it. Oh and yeah, if you only learned 30 words, finish the basic schedule first. The first common word are so common that you will see them everywhere anyway.

Okay, that's for the groundwork. The last important, not for now but for later, is to choose your medium. And really, depending on that, it can be heaven or hell. There's a lot of factor involved but the main ones are just:
- Context (visual clue for example)
- General level of difficulty

- Your familiarity with the subject/medium

For example, pure text are harder than text with image. Pure text are also harder than manga and manga are harder than image book (like the one for kids). Video are easier than text because they are a lot of visual clue and also emotional clue. Podcast are generally harder because there are no clue except for sound. Etc.

On the second factor, discussion with a lot of people are harder than a dialogue. It's obvious but you don't always think about that before choosing a medium. Specific topic are also harder (except if you worked on that before). Story or song are also more difficult in general because they use more refined expression like マイコー explained it. Casual conversation will be easier because there are more general. Etc.

And lastly, well just how much you know about the subject. For example, rewatching your favorite anime that you already watch countless time will be easier than watching a new anime. Watching anything that you're familiar will be easier than trying something that you don't usually read or watch. If you like cooking for example, well watching cooking will be easier. Just because well, you know the ingredient well, you know the techniques, etc. And even, if you don't know all the word, well, you will be able to guess it from the situation.

You can play on all of that to have an easier time. When you will try your first immersion medium, you can think about those. And to give you some example, well on the discord, there is the book club. You can easily try the first level (the books are rank in difficulty). Why because they are often image book and use basic vocabulary. Maybe in 2-3 month, once you learned all of the basic word, you will be able to start there.

As for video, well, there is a famous youtube cooking channel that is really great for beginners. It's great because it's a mother with her child and she often use simple Japanese to talk to her child (like "Do you like cucumber? Yes I like cucumber"). And if you like cooking, well congrats, you will be lucky enough to have a medium that you can watch on your free time and is quite simple to start with. And if you don't like little human, you can also try cat video if you like them. Whatever works for you. And btw, I'm serious about the cat video. There will be small vocabulary, interjection mostly, not a lot of course but well, if you're already watching them in your own language, might as well switch to Japanese one.

Anyway, I've tons of others example like that. Like, in my case, I like game. So I watch youtube video about that. But even there, I still often choose repetitive/action game. Why? Because repetitive are repetitive and once I watch a few of them, I only learned "variant" (like similar vocabulary, expression, grammar pattern). And for action, well, same as the idea with the cooking channel. There are less complicated sentences, less vocabulary, etc. Story game are still just a nightmare because of my lack of vocabulary.

But that's just an example based on my interest =p
On that part you need to think for yourself. Even song could be a good (bi)monthly exercises despite their inherent problem. Like use the text analyzer, create a word schedule, a grammar schedule and a sentences schedule. Study them for a month or two and at the same time listen to that song. BUT choose them also on their difficult. Don't choose overcomplicated ones with a lot of metaphor. And finish the basic schedule too before.

Anyway (second time), why do I talk so much, omg.
I'm stopping here. Good luck on your journey and have fun while learning, that's the most important part è_é
Bye bye, ってね、またね~

8
10 months ago
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These were kind of a novel to read but I just wanted to say I appreciate the replies and the original poster for asking, as I was wondering about this but didn’t think to ask.

2
10 months ago
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I don't know enough to really get much out of "immersion", but I do like to listen to Japanese conversations/narrations/podcasts on YouTube, passively when I'm doing other activities, just to get exposed to the flow (rhythm, sounds, etc). Some that I listen to are from the YouTube channels もしもしゆうすけLearn Japanese with Tanaka san, Miku Real Japanese, Nihongo-Learning, YUYUのPodcast, and more. I also listen to Japanese video game playthroughs. (EDIT: This isn't exactly immersion, it's learning, but it uses "immersion" of each section before the analysis, and I think it's cool so I thought I'd mention it... learning Japanese with Final Fantasy VII Remake.)


They're all very different, and at different levels, but I'm not listening to really understand... just to get an "ear" for the sounds and rhythms. It's a bonus when I pick up on words or phrases that I know, and as I learn, I pick up on more. But I'm not using them to actually learn vocabulary or grammar... I do that on renshuu.

3
10 months ago
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cream00
Level: 263

I recommend if you learn more enough vocab and grammar u can start watching anime that is aimed at younger audience at leisure time, so u can get use of how some sentence is used or learn sth new(usually only apply when you know majority of the grammar and vocabs)

but I really like watching doraemon (ドラえもん), quite fun and the setting is based on daily life(kinda?). but the original japanese version doesnt have japanese subtitles so might need to look on youtube for it, and -best friend these youtubers gives japanese and chinese simplified subtitle(they got more videos in their channel). not sure if there are that give english subtitle though.

( • ̀ω•́ )✧

3
10 months ago
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カイリネ
Level: 563

Immersion - it's a nice add-on along with your study. Keep on studying with renshu, cover all - vocab/listening/writing/reading. I advise you to get something real like reading news and podcasts later on. Songs/films/anime/manga - those are your "interests" and qualifies under something to widen your knowledge but not something you can rely on. You said that you sound more "anime-ish" so I am aware of your studying style 😅

On the another hand - this is not so much of immersion but "application" you need - what you've learned you apply, polishing it along the way. Eventually you'll be always learning because "language" and "spoken language" are always go hand-to-hand with basic things like vocab and grammar.

Wish you good luck on that and surely you need to invest more time, I, for example, will be using songs just to confirm my progress and refresh my memory about words that I've learned recently.

1
10 months ago
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